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Does 2D still have a chance?

Submitted by Skribble on
Forum

Well im not sure if many of u know about it, but one of the best animators on the web, Dan Paladin( aka synj ), and owner of Newgrounds.com, Tom Fulp ,and there team "The Behemoth" are releasing a console version of the smash hit online platformer "Alien Hominid".

The game is remenisant to the popular Metal Slug game. This version of AH, unlike the online one, features entirly new art, coding, style, attacks, upgrades, enemies and maybe the best explosions ever seen. The game is redone down to the style of alien hominid himself.

haha i sound like a telemarketer or sumthing.

Anyways, the game is 2D, but features certain 3D enviroment aspects and global physics that allows destrucable buildings, vertex lighting and such. The animation is in a league of its own, and the explosions are just... wow!

Also my friend Rift (awesome coder) is working with Edmund McMillin(very awesome artist) on a game that they are planning to release on console as well, also 2D.

So onto my question...

Do you think that 2D games will make a comeback onto the newer gaming systems?

PS: ive provided sum links below for info

http://newgrounds.com/portal/view/59593 - AH prototype
www.alienhominid.com - AH official site
www.thebehemoth.com - creators of AH console version
www.newgrounds.com - Toms site
www.etgames.com - rifts site
www.thisisacryforhelp.com - edmunds site

Submitted by Kane on Tue, 05/10/04 - 5:29 PM Permalink

I personally don't think 2D is dead... dying , very slowly, maybe but certainly not dead...

I have recently got back into my Super Nintendo and I can sit on that thing for hours playing 2D games like:

Donkey Kong Country
Yoshi's Island
BattleToads
etc, etc...

I can play any of these games much longer than I can sit and play any 3D game I own...

I think that the quality of 2D games gameplay wise was much higher back when those games were out...someone just needs to bring back that quality...[:D]

That said, with unique games like Gish and such, I think 2D gaming will be around for a while longer... [8D]

Submitted by Blitz on Tue, 05/10/04 - 11:27 PM Permalink

2D will never die as long as their are portable consoles with small screens. It will also stay well alive in the small PC markets, however i think for decent commercial releases on PC/console it will start to find itself confined to puzzle games and fighting games.
CYer, Blitz

Submitted by souri on Wed, 06/10/04 - 3:19 AM Permalink

I actually checked out a bit of Alien Hominid by chance today, and it looks really great. It was good to see that they were putting in a lot of fun things to do like driving vehicles, special moves, and other things rather than a bog standard sideway scroller. The animation and explosions are great!

If anyone has a cable connection and they wanna check out Alien Hominid (chat with the animators and developers on how things got started, a tour of their small studio, and a great look at the game), go to http://www.gamespot.com/onthespot/ and click on the streaming media for 07/29/04 .. - I've been watching a lot of the streams at http://www.gamespot.com/onthespot/ - it's so much better watching reviewers talk about the games and see footage as they talk rather than reading about it on a webpage. Plus they do tonne of developer interviews and studio walthroughs too..

Just a note on that particular stream - there were about 3 or 4 other *new* games of a 2D nature that they were reviewing in there. Apart from Alien Hominid, they were all from Japan. It seems 2D games is still alive and kicking over there, from side way scrolling beat'em ups (Viewtiful Joe), fighting games (Samurai Showdown 5, Guilty Gear), and I'm sure 2D sideway/vertical scrolling shoot'em ups are still very popular there too..

Submitted by souri on Thu, 07/10/04 - 10:38 PM Permalink

Just to add, 2D games got a pretty hefty blow when Sony limited most things 2D from being released on the PS2..

Submitted by palantir on Fri, 08/10/04 - 7:13 AM Permalink

Yeah, but it turned out to be a smart marketing strategy. Most people these days don?t look twice at a title if it isn?t 3D.

Submitted by Skribble on Sun, 10/10/04 - 9:00 PM Permalink

Perhaps this will change their mind ^_^ once you see the things you can pull off in this game, you become hypnotised. My workmate is buying a gamecube just so he can get AH. [:D]

Submitted by Cam on Wed, 17/11/04 - 8:49 PM Permalink

quote:Originally posted by palantir

Yeah, but it turned out to be a smart marketing strategy. Most people these days don?t look twice at a title if it isn?t 3D.

maybe the reason why people don't look twice at a title if it is not 3d is because 3d is all they know as that's what's being shoved down their throats by the marketing people =)

Submitted by LostSanitY on Thu, 18/11/04 - 5:51 PM Permalink

2d might be dead on consoles, but they still have 3d games that play like 2d games (constriction of the z-axis).
like crash bandicoot or something similar.

the new fighting games that have 3d backgrounds look awsome! the old franchises have kept their characters 2d tho, maybe that because they are justing using old sprites?

hmm... do you guys think its easier to make, say a platformer, with sprites, or 3d models? in reality of it, its still just bounding boxes flying around a screen, in either 2d or 3d.

Submitted by Daemin on Thu, 18/11/04 - 11:44 PM Permalink

I think a new type of 2d game will evolve from this all. One that combines the traditional gameplay elements from 2d games and brings it into a 3d setting, or uses 3d technology to give it more oompth. Think Duke Nukem Manhattan project, or something such as a platformer using a 2d foreground and characters (taken from highly detailed 3d models) and put them into a 2d parralax world that's actually coded in 3d. Or something like TA, that used 2d background graphics, along with 3d data and units to create a highly detailed believable 3d world.

Nothing really ever dies, it just evolves and/or becomes a very (small) niche market.

Submitted by conundrum on Fri, 19/11/04 - 12:25 PM Permalink

ive personally always really loved the look and style of 2d over most 3d games. daemin i think paper mario does something sorta like that as well and it has been pretty highly praised.

Submitted by MattD on Sat, 20/11/04 - 9:19 PM Permalink

well the shift to 3d powered handhelds will make things interesting. 3D is even making it into phones these days.. but for the next little while specs like MIDP v2 and BREW mean that 2d will be very well represented for the near future at least

how much 3d will we really find on these things (phones)? particle effects? freeform sprite rotation and scaling (sadly missing from MIDP v2)? kinda reminds me of the SNES era all over again :D

Matt D

Submitted by Daemin on Tue, 23/11/04 - 1:55 AM Permalink

Yeah, the publishers like mobile phones, because they're the same as the console platforms of yore, and they can use the same IP and same art - just different code - to produce classic games for a new market, thus more revenue for essentially very little effort.

Submitted by beefcake on Tue, 23/11/04 - 10:44 AM Permalink

the reason people forgot about 2d was because it's so easy to market for 3d... for example the first wave could be like "LOOK AT THIS 3D GAMES!!! REAL 3D! FORGET 2D! THIS CONSOLE IS THE FUTURE BUY IT NOW!!!"
and the current ones "WOW EVEN BETTER 3D THIS IS MORE FUTURISTIC THAN EVER! IT MAY BE THE SAME REHASHED GAMEPLAY BUT JUST LOOK AT THE POLY COUNT!"[B)]

biggest shame was when worms went 3d... vector is the next step for 2d!!! they did it because there is a bigger market for 3d games, but there is also a bigger market for real time games! so i bet when they run out of ideas they will make it real time[V]

Submitted by sub on Sun, 24/07/05 - 12:30 PM Permalink

2D is my fave scene =)

Posted by Skribble on
Forum

Well im not sure if many of u know about it, but one of the best animators on the web, Dan Paladin( aka synj ), and owner of Newgrounds.com, Tom Fulp ,and there team "The Behemoth" are releasing a console version of the smash hit online platformer "Alien Hominid".

The game is remenisant to the popular Metal Slug game. This version of AH, unlike the online one, features entirly new art, coding, style, attacks, upgrades, enemies and maybe the best explosions ever seen. The game is redone down to the style of alien hominid himself.

haha i sound like a telemarketer or sumthing.

Anyways, the game is 2D, but features certain 3D enviroment aspects and global physics that allows destrucable buildings, vertex lighting and such. The animation is in a league of its own, and the explosions are just... wow!

Also my friend Rift (awesome coder) is working with Edmund McMillin(very awesome artist) on a game that they are planning to release on console as well, also 2D.

So onto my question...

Do you think that 2D games will make a comeback onto the newer gaming systems?

PS: ive provided sum links below for info

http://newgrounds.com/portal/view/59593 - AH prototype
www.alienhominid.com - AH official site
www.thebehemoth.com - creators of AH console version
www.newgrounds.com - Toms site
www.etgames.com - rifts site
www.thisisacryforhelp.com - edmunds site


Submitted by Kane on Tue, 05/10/04 - 5:29 PM Permalink

I personally don't think 2D is dead... dying , very slowly, maybe but certainly not dead...

I have recently got back into my Super Nintendo and I can sit on that thing for hours playing 2D games like:

Donkey Kong Country
Yoshi's Island
BattleToads
etc, etc...

I can play any of these games much longer than I can sit and play any 3D game I own...

I think that the quality of 2D games gameplay wise was much higher back when those games were out...someone just needs to bring back that quality...[:D]

That said, with unique games like Gish and such, I think 2D gaming will be around for a while longer... [8D]

Submitted by Blitz on Tue, 05/10/04 - 11:27 PM Permalink

2D will never die as long as their are portable consoles with small screens. It will also stay well alive in the small PC markets, however i think for decent commercial releases on PC/console it will start to find itself confined to puzzle games and fighting games.
CYer, Blitz

Submitted by souri on Wed, 06/10/04 - 3:19 AM Permalink

I actually checked out a bit of Alien Hominid by chance today, and it looks really great. It was good to see that they were putting in a lot of fun things to do like driving vehicles, special moves, and other things rather than a bog standard sideway scroller. The animation and explosions are great!

If anyone has a cable connection and they wanna check out Alien Hominid (chat with the animators and developers on how things got started, a tour of their small studio, and a great look at the game), go to http://www.gamespot.com/onthespot/ and click on the streaming media for 07/29/04 .. - I've been watching a lot of the streams at http://www.gamespot.com/onthespot/ - it's so much better watching reviewers talk about the games and see footage as they talk rather than reading about it on a webpage. Plus they do tonne of developer interviews and studio walthroughs too..

Just a note on that particular stream - there were about 3 or 4 other *new* games of a 2D nature that they were reviewing in there. Apart from Alien Hominid, they were all from Japan. It seems 2D games is still alive and kicking over there, from side way scrolling beat'em ups (Viewtiful Joe), fighting games (Samurai Showdown 5, Guilty Gear), and I'm sure 2D sideway/vertical scrolling shoot'em ups are still very popular there too..

Submitted by souri on Thu, 07/10/04 - 10:38 PM Permalink

Just to add, 2D games got a pretty hefty blow when Sony limited most things 2D from being released on the PS2..

Submitted by palantir on Fri, 08/10/04 - 7:13 AM Permalink

Yeah, but it turned out to be a smart marketing strategy. Most people these days don?t look twice at a title if it isn?t 3D.

Submitted by Skribble on Sun, 10/10/04 - 9:00 PM Permalink

Perhaps this will change their mind ^_^ once you see the things you can pull off in this game, you become hypnotised. My workmate is buying a gamecube just so he can get AH. [:D]

Submitted by Cam on Wed, 17/11/04 - 8:49 PM Permalink

quote:Originally posted by palantir

Yeah, but it turned out to be a smart marketing strategy. Most people these days don?t look twice at a title if it isn?t 3D.

maybe the reason why people don't look twice at a title if it is not 3d is because 3d is all they know as that's what's being shoved down their throats by the marketing people =)

Submitted by LostSanitY on Thu, 18/11/04 - 5:51 PM Permalink

2d might be dead on consoles, but they still have 3d games that play like 2d games (constriction of the z-axis).
like crash bandicoot or something similar.

the new fighting games that have 3d backgrounds look awsome! the old franchises have kept their characters 2d tho, maybe that because they are justing using old sprites?

hmm... do you guys think its easier to make, say a platformer, with sprites, or 3d models? in reality of it, its still just bounding boxes flying around a screen, in either 2d or 3d.

Submitted by Daemin on Thu, 18/11/04 - 11:44 PM Permalink

I think a new type of 2d game will evolve from this all. One that combines the traditional gameplay elements from 2d games and brings it into a 3d setting, or uses 3d technology to give it more oompth. Think Duke Nukem Manhattan project, or something such as a platformer using a 2d foreground and characters (taken from highly detailed 3d models) and put them into a 2d parralax world that's actually coded in 3d. Or something like TA, that used 2d background graphics, along with 3d data and units to create a highly detailed believable 3d world.

Nothing really ever dies, it just evolves and/or becomes a very (small) niche market.

Submitted by conundrum on Fri, 19/11/04 - 12:25 PM Permalink

ive personally always really loved the look and style of 2d over most 3d games. daemin i think paper mario does something sorta like that as well and it has been pretty highly praised.

Submitted by MattD on Sat, 20/11/04 - 9:19 PM Permalink

well the shift to 3d powered handhelds will make things interesting. 3D is even making it into phones these days.. but for the next little while specs like MIDP v2 and BREW mean that 2d will be very well represented for the near future at least

how much 3d will we really find on these things (phones)? particle effects? freeform sprite rotation and scaling (sadly missing from MIDP v2)? kinda reminds me of the SNES era all over again :D

Matt D

Submitted by Daemin on Tue, 23/11/04 - 1:55 AM Permalink

Yeah, the publishers like mobile phones, because they're the same as the console platforms of yore, and they can use the same IP and same art - just different code - to produce classic games for a new market, thus more revenue for essentially very little effort.

Submitted by beefcake on Tue, 23/11/04 - 10:44 AM Permalink

the reason people forgot about 2d was because it's so easy to market for 3d... for example the first wave could be like "LOOK AT THIS 3D GAMES!!! REAL 3D! FORGET 2D! THIS CONSOLE IS THE FUTURE BUY IT NOW!!!"
and the current ones "WOW EVEN BETTER 3D THIS IS MORE FUTURISTIC THAN EVER! IT MAY BE THE SAME REHASHED GAMEPLAY BUT JUST LOOK AT THE POLY COUNT!"[B)]

biggest shame was when worms went 3d... vector is the next step for 2d!!! they did it because there is a bigger market for 3d games, but there is also a bigger market for real time games! so i bet when they run out of ideas they will make it real time[V]

Submitted by sub on Sun, 24/07/05 - 12:30 PM Permalink

2D is my fave scene =)