AGDC04 - Thoughts/Feelings

So people.. now that another year is over.. what do those who went think of the event this year?

warm fuzzy's or icky shiver's?

Cam's picture

for me personally it was warm fuzzy's.. mostly because:

- got to catch up with everyone that i met there last year and also got to meet a whole heap more people too. was excellent to see everyone who came down from the aie in canberra, and qantm in brissy and see their work (loved both roach-rage and scootarama - though both still need an 'x' in the title heh)

- i think i got more from the individual sessions this year as opposed to last years. this is probably because i think now i'm a bit more focused on what i want to do and what areas actually interest me. really enjoyed the design and art tracks (and still managed to get into a few of the production sessions as well)

- chatted with bill roper about zombie flicks =)

- am convinced that i'm going to win a random prize next year as you can't go three years without anything based purely on the number of tickets that i managed to accumulate..

- ooh, and i got killed in an art session as a 'programmer' and was worth 50 points instead of the usual 1 point that every other student was worth ;)

MoonUnit's picture

yeah me and cam got shot, go us!... (and both labelled as programmers even thought im an artist and cams uhh... unspecified :P )

all in all i had a blast and it was great to meet everyone and go out for lunch together etc. on the educational side of it all i learnt a lot, got a chance to ask some questions but was also thoughroly (sp?) entertained.

see you all again next year :D

LiveWire's picture

hehehe, how many tickets did you have again? funny that you cant win with even that many and i had only four and got a prize!
as for the name, maybe if we do a sequal or a handheld version or something we can call it ScootaramaX ;).
Bill was great fun, we shot him a lot at the awards dinner.

and as for my experience, i loved it this year. not becuase of the presentations, which i didnt get to see much of cos i was standing at my booth most of the time, but cos i got to present and all the people that i met. it was great, much more fun than last year. ofcourse made all the more better when we found out we won the indie comp too.

now i'm still in melbounre at a netcafe, just bought Metroid Prime 2 and cant wait to get home to play it.

yusuf's picture

My comments on the AGDC Academic Summit are at http://staff.it.uts.edu.au/~ypisan/wl/ I will post some more about the general conference later, but compared to last year there were much less people from the USA which is a shame.

Sorceror Bob's picture

I didn't go.. But...

Career Achievement Award - John De Margheriti, Micro Fort?

You've gotta be fucking kidding me!!

Bigworld is virtually vapour-ware, while MF has had periods of massive growth, followed by massive layoffs. The whole thing reeks of bad decisions from the top of the company..

It should have gone to John Passfield or John Chey, or one of the many other people worthy of the honour... As far as I can tell, both Krome and Irrational have grown solidly - without the need for mass layoffs, not to mention actually releasing their titles on schedule.

lorien's picture

I wonder how many people have similar thoughts to those so eloquently expressed above by Sorceror Bob.

Don't think I've seen a moderator use the "f" word in a forum before :)

Sorceror Bob's picture

I AM THE ANTI MODERATOR!!

Tehcnically I retired from my mod duties a few weeks back... still have the name thingy there though

Sooo.. My opinions are mine, not representative of sumea.

unknownuser2's picture

anti-moderator ..... that sounds like a monster out of a final fantasy game. [:D]

Sorceror Bob's picture

eww... final fantasy

J I Styles's picture

quote:Originally posted by Cam

for me personally it was warm fuzzy's.. mostly because:

- am convinced that i'm going to win a random prize next year as you can't go three years without anything based purely on the number of tickets that i managed to accumulate..

yes, you can go 3 years without winning anything. Proof of that right here [:)]

Cam's picture

quote:Originally posted by J.I. Styles

quote:Originally posted by Cam

for me personally it was warm fuzzy's.. mostly because:

- am convinced that i'm going to win a random prize next year as you can't go three years without anything based purely on the number of tickets that i managed to accumulate..

yes, you can go 3 years without winning anything. Proof of that right here [:)]

nooooooo... the humanity =)
there are just some things i wasn't created to hear - oh btw.. if i ended up calling you james or josh over the three days i apologise, for some reason when i see your face i think of everyname starting with j except for the right one heh!

James A Burke's picture

Career Achievement Award - John De Margheriti, Micro Fort?

You've gotta be fucking kidding me!!

He owns AGDC *could* have rigged it :p Though, he gave me and the team a free pass to the conference (we were only in the expo to present in the unsigned indie) so I was glad he won ;) Because they ain't cheap ;) We did win the Hyne's Pitching contest which I think pissed off the AIE entries (wasn't my fault they were drunk when presenting ;) ).

souri's picture

C'mon, I seriously doubt the organisers would rig it so that John D.M would win. Time to take off the tin foil hats I think [:)]. To be honest, I think it's actually quite deserving for John D.M to win it this time - he's set up the AIE, the GDAA, Micro Forte etc, you really can't deny that he's achieved quite a heck of lot for the industry. Yeh, I know there are plenty of people here willing to debate on that, but I would love to hear who else you think is more deserving. When the AGDC awards started, there were a handful of people in my list who are deserving of the award. Adam Lancman, Robert Walsh, John De Margheriti, John Passfield, Steve Stamatiadis etc. The first three listed there have received it, and I am rooting for John and Steve to win it one day in the future. Their time will come!

Jacana's picture

quote:Originally posted by James A. Burke

We did win the Hyne's Pitching contest which I think pissed off the AIE entries (wasn't my fault they were drunk when presenting ;) ).

Errrr - there were three AIE teams presenting there. Of which I know only one group was still even hung over.

As for pissing off AIE entries I don't think so - most of us were quite happy to see a group of young guys who are extermly dedicated get a nod for it.

lorien's picture

quote:Originally posted by Souri
but I would love to hear who else you think is more deserving.

Well it is for "career advancement", why is everyone acting like this should be confined to managers?

I'd be inclined to give it to an aie/qantm grad who has been working in woolies for years since graduating and got a games job this year. Don't know if there were any though.

lorien's picture

Or maybe HazarD.

Blitz's picture

Uhh.... Career Achievment Award, i think most people would agree that the award is intended to be presented to someone who has achieved many things in their games industry career. I don't think someone who has barely even *started* their career in the games industry really qualifies.
It's not confined to managers, but it is confined to people who have achieved many things in their career. It just so happens that these people tend to either own/run large game (related) companies now. I'm sure that would require some amount of management.
Hazard...maybe in 5 or 10 years :)
CYer, Blitz

unknownuser2's picture

Thanks for the thought Lorien [:D] I'm trying, but dont think im worthy of anything drastic yet. Maybe in a year or 2 if im lucky

James A Burke's picture

quote:Originally posted by Jacana
Errrr - there were three AIE teams presenting there. Of which I know only one group was still even hung over.

Oh, there were 3? I thought one of them was, another a uni and another a small team? And it was the first years that were ;)

J I Styles's picture

as someone on the outside of all the schools and groups, just wanted to clarify, as I understand it:

Saber - AIE Canberra 1st year
Roach Rage - AIE Canberra 2nd year
Crescent Moon - AIE Canberra 2nd year
Plague - AIE Melbourne

Saber was the more ill-prepared presentation suffering from a hangover, which I may note many others where suffering from as well from such a big night before [:)] (no, that's not an admittance I was too... just ringing eardrums from the stupidly loud music/karaoke) -- so they where hung over and not as best prepared as could've been, but not drunk.

Last note, seems to be quite the opposite feeling about you guys winning the pitch -- general impressions seem to point to you having a very tight and well prepared pitch, and a lot of people relaying that it was cool to see your group win it, especially to see the younger members getting in there and showing their enthusiasm and abilities and coming up tops.

So, congrats everyone! You got your names out there, showed your projects, and got the opportunity to make contacts and meet new people - in my opinion, at the end of the conferance, that's the most valuable thing that everyone took away.

on another note, does anyone know how the career award and game sub category awards are chosen? I mean, the indie games are clean cut voting at the event, but how are the other awards tallied and chosen?

Mdobele's picture

Hi. I was one of the coders on Scootarama. Just wanted to say thanks for the top 4 days I had down there. Had a complete blast with everyone. Well done to the young guys that won the pitching comp, heard you really had your act together. Scares the crap outta me when i think what you guys will be able to do when you hit my age. Makes me glad we didnt bother to enter it [:D].... you woulda owned us as well LOL.

I was very impressed with all the other games on show as well, hope you are all recieveing as much attention as we have gotten from it and that you all are sucessfull in entering the industry in your respective fields. See you all next year.

Mik

Oh. PS

Just one thing I did want to mention to the AIE guys ( all groups ) was I was a little surprised to see ALL of you guys LEAVE your booths unattended for long periods of time. Seriously people would talk to us for a while, then go to your games and cause nobody was there they would simply walk away without playing / seeing it. Mayby you guys had other commitments with your volunteering but you really have to be there in order to talk to people and sell your game and yourself.

Bunny's picture

I'm afraid I have to agree with Sorceror Bob. Frankly John has very little to show for years of spending other people's money other than a hell of a lot of empty promises. There's too many ex-MF staffers with broken hearts and homes.

I'd vote for Jon Chey, or Steve Stamatiadis. And what about Tony Oakden? As I understand it Tribes shipped with no overtime, which is worthy of recognition on its own. Ed Orman's had a short career, but he's already got more quality titles under his belt than the wonderful blowhard of Aus. If I keep listing people I'll be here all night. But how about someone that is concerned with the here and now of getting cool games on the shelves and paying their staff, instead of big shiny empty gestures?

CynicalFan's picture

Hmmm? Lifetime Achievement Award? or should that read: Lifetime Hype Award?

It is in my humblest of opinions that such an award should be (and is intended to be) awarded to an individual based upon what they have achieved for the industry as a whole, not based upon what they have achieved for themselves or their own studio.

John DM might have played a part in the past, but, he plays none now other than to hinder this industries growth, with the full effects of his actions not to be seen possibly for some years yet.

As for Jon Chey, Steve Stamatiadis, Tony Oakden and Ed Orman, well I don?t think they have really done much to help the industry as a whole, just themselves and their respective studios ? I believe that Irrational did work overtime, but, they most likely bothered to minimise it as much as possible, and adequately compensated the team members for their sacrifice, and this did nothing for the industry as a whole.

I suspect that an individual worthy of such an award really goes unnoticed by the industry, and may never be appreciated until many years from now, if at all.

There are so many that go unnoticed by the industry as a whole as these individuals don?t actively seek such attention, there actions are genuine in their wanting to help others, instead of themselves. They are no recognised by their peers, as their peers are usually ignorant towards their contributions to the industry and how they have bettered it for all. They may even be resented and despised, as such actions though in the long-term will better everyone, has unfortunately in the short-term, not bettered everyone.

I?m surprised to see which titles got awarded this year. It is kind of the opposite that occurred a year or two ago. I recall that Krome?s Ty title won over Freedom Force ? which in my opinion is a far superior title ? yet this time around Ty2 lost to Tribes3. I wonder if this would have played out the same if there was not a backlash of sorts to a poll on Australia?s best title? I wonder if nothing were said, which title would have been decided upon for this years respective award?

BTW: does anyone know how this award is calculated, whom nominated the title, who decides upon the title? I recall something about an industry committee?

Anyway, so far from what I have read and heard, this year there were far more fresh faces to experienced industry veterans. And the consensus seems to be that the experienced mob are sick and tired of what gets dished up, talks like Micro Forte?s ?How to make an MMOG in 1 hour!? Really, I thought it usually took 5 years or something ;) that is if you have a clue.

Personally, I hope this year will see Free Play continue and grow larger and better in quality, just like the first AGDC did with its follow up year. Hopefully it will flourish into a high-quality and competitive event to the AGDC ? I suspect it will ? and become an event and medium not afraid to set new standards for the industry, and address real issues, and distil real know-how into the industry, to both experienced developers and newbies alike ? minus all the marketing hype!

Sorceror Bob's picture

The reason I put Jon Chey's name forward was in regards to the amount of positive publicity that Tribes3 secured for the Australian Game Industry as a whole.. It strengthens our reputation for getting the job done with a minimal of fuss..
Jon C can't be given all of the credit for this, but his position at the top makes him suitable for the award. Tony Oakden would be a good choice as well.

The same cannot be said for MF, but we can so far be thankful that most of the negativity has remained within our shores.

I won't argue the fact that John D has done some good things for the industry, but in recent years I think he has trodden on too many people without any real progress. I'm doubtful that Bigworld will have any sizeable impact on the MMOG genre, it's years too late, and will need a huge amount of innovation if it's going to pull people away from games with solid fan-bases.

Yeah yeah, then theres BW tech.. But it hasn't exactly made the news recently.

I'm not trying to dump more manure on this thread, just stating the reasoning behind my original statement.

UniqueSnowFlake's picture

On the note of Big world.... please correct me if I'm wrong.. but I thought I hear that MF sold the technology to Mircosoft. During that time and soon after Mircosoft went under new management and canned anything that had a risk to it. eg. BigWorld was going to be MMOG for the X-box and the X-box live group isn't that big and there hasn't been that type of game for it. Soo.. Bigworld ended up getting canned.
Like I said I could be total wrong.. just thought I over heard that from somewhere.

Blitz's picture

Bigworld and citizen zero are not the same entity. Bigworld is the MMOG engine tech, citizen zero is/was a game being built on the Bigworld tech. MF always retained the rights to the Bigworld tech, and has licensed it out to about 4 other companies last time i checked. The citizen zero IP may have been owned by microsoft at one point? Either MF got it back when MS canned the project, or they never had it (since MF have the IP for cz atm, and it was still in production last time i checked a month or so ago).

[quote=CynicalFan]It is in my humblest of opinions that such an award should be (and is intended to be) awarded to an individual based upon what they have achieved for the industry as a whole, not based upon what they have achieved for themselves or their own studio.[/quote]
I know your views on the "benefits" of these organisations is somewhat negative, but wasn't john responsible, in part, for setting up the GDAA, AGDC, and AIE. If any of these organisations can have been considered beneficial to the industry, then surely they are worth recognising. I'm not trying to defend any bad business practices he may have employed at MF or whatever, but i think, if he did have a hand in setting up these organisations, it is probably worthy of recognition.
CYer, Blitz

CynicalFan's picture

Yes Blitz, that is a worthy enough reason to get this award, but he has already gotten this award in the past for this ? I think a few times. And as Soccer Bob said, he played his part in the past, helped establish these organisations, but he has played his part and is only hindering things at the moment ? I know that sounds harsh, but the truth can be at times, and many of us will end up in a similar boat in time.

Perhaps such an award should not necessarily be awarded every year, just when the industry feels that there is such an individual worthy of it. Have it more of a special and prized award for someone?s contribution to the industry.

Giving it out every year to the same guy seems to belittle and trivialise the award.

As far as I know Microsoft canned the deal when Micro Forte showed that they couldn?t deliver anything but technology ? soon after they let go of most of the Sydney team, and now only have a skeleton crew. As far as I know, they are not even bothering with Citizen Zero anymore, and are just focusing on the technology, aiming this time around for the mobile market ? there was a news item months ago about this I think, involving the Canberra studio.

I personally think they should move on, but I also hope it finally pays off, but I suspect that the amount of money they make in licensing deals will in no way come close to breaking even to the funding they have utilised in the tech?s creation. Especially if you factor in all the grant money they have received to develop it with ? which they may not have to pay back, a plus for them, but would be unrealistic if left out of calculating profits generated from such deals.

And this is kind of my reasoning for Micro Forte?s actions hindering the industry in the long-term, because their failed actions and hollow promises will only dry up and scare off sources of funding from game development, which are only funding in such development due to ignorance of our industry on a global and local scale, and what they have been told by our industries ?experts? ? but this is changing.

We need to nurture and grow such sources of funding for the betterment and long-term longevity of the local industry; otherwise things might get a little rough ahead.

But not to be too negative, where one opportunity disappears, others soon appear [:)]