General Chat

Sweet as! Congrats and enjoy! @:-)

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

I've been told that a few of the AIE lecturers have been letting the students know about this site, so when you do the course next year, be sure to inform the ones that don't, ok ! [;)]

well thats how i found this site originally
had a flyer type thingy on the door

That which makes us human will inevitably destroy us.

Some Quantm lecturers have been telling their students too, so the word is getting around. [;)] I think a site like Sumea is really beneficial for graduates and students.. You can find what companies are doing what kind of games, and it's the only place I know of with a record of Australian game job listings..

I think bigkid.com.au also lists jobs when they find out about them. But this site is definately a great resource for aussie game devs and wannabe's :)
CYer, Blitz

Oh yeh, I forgot about Bigkid [:)]..

Souri - you could try and get some funding from the GDAA or something to run and improve this site if it starts getting much larger than it already is.

And IMO bigkid.com.au is more like a general technology site that does reviews, not a dedicated knowledge site like sumea is.

Yeah, i was just noting that it also did job ads for game positions in aus :)
CYer, Blitz

Bigkid's also run by Krome-ians @:-)

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

quote: Souri - you could try and get some funding from the GDAA or something to run and improve this site if it starts getting much larger than it already is.

I'm kinda expecting my webhosts to email me any time now that I've went over my allocated webspace limit [:)], so I'm hoping to get funding soonish.. (deleting the Titus demo, and the Infogrames mp3 are temporary solutions to that though, so the site won't be shoved offline or anything).
And yeh, funding would be great! I could get more needed webspace, and hey, it's a good incentive for me to fix and add more things to the site :).. There's tonnes of things I'd like to change and improve.
I'm still currently waiting on a response for sponsorship. I don't think I can tell you who they are yet, but I'm sure you all know of them.. if they help out, it'll only cover hosting though. I might send off an email to the GDAA though.. *fingers crossed*

well either the GDAA or the AIE would be ideal sponsors, perhaps even some big gaming studio in Austrlia could fund tihs little operation. Perhaps Infogrammes Melbourne House?

Sponsorship wouldn't necessarily have to be from game studios either. I get quite a lot of google hits from people searching for information on 3D Studio max prices, student discounts, distributors etc in Australia, so Discreet would be a good sponsor too [:)].. in anyway, I might just make a sponsor request page on the site and see what happens..
Oh, and Infogrames Melbourne House would be a great sponsor too. [;)] [:D]

Krome-ians ? Krome-ites!! [:D]

Krome-ites?
Sounds like something you see a doctor about!

"Yes I Code"
As found on AGDC name tag 2002

Perhaps Kromers, but that sends out the wrong message... @;-)

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

nope, when did they come out?

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

Hey, do you have a link?

http://www.nvidia.com/areyouready

I think... the navigation bar on it sucks... I think it's like the second last Icon or something

I played poker with a Tarot deck the other night. I got a full house and four people died.

--Steven Wright.

Yeh, the nav is terrible. You don't see the buttons until your mouse is over it, and you're still quite not sure what the buttons go to..

To skip the flash nav and go to the movie:

http://www.nvidia.com/content/areyouready/index.asp?task=settings&video…

the movies seem to be TV type ads, with real actors etc and no graphic effects though??

yep there just ads, you think they would have some sort of amazing graphical effects to show off what their advertising, but no.

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

In a related topic, GeforceFX page and demo info.. and some pics.

http://www.nvidia.com/view.asp?PAGE=geforcefx
http://www.nvidia.com/view.asp?PAGE=geforcefx_demos

[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/simagesmisc/large01.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/simagesmisc/large02.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/simagesmisc/large03.jpg[/img]

Those pictures are fantasic, she really looks beautiful. these pics are certainly good and all, but they are a bit of deception. "Look at what our graphics cards can do" is what they say, but really this kind of detail is only achievable in small scenes, sure these are realtime but theres only one major thing on screen, the fairy and if you've seen it, the wolfman, none of this is really applicable to games. It makes people think "wow this is what games will look like If I buy this" when really its nowhere near the truth. I'd be more impressed if they could show it rendering a scene with something like 30 or so 3000 poly models all on screen at the same time with a smooth frame rate, instead of one mega detailed character.

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

It's more of a showing off of the shader technology I think. You can see some of the skin bumpmapping (in the close up pic, shoulder area).. plus the hair which looks awesome.. oh, and the fact that the skin doesn't look like it's plastic.. plus there must be some funky effect happening with the wings.. [:)] and no jaggies in sight..

Some of the other demos are interesting too. Especially of that car which changes from new to a rusty heap.

I think the model is awesome.. I might just post some more images on her then.

[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/simagesmisc/image12.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/simagesmisc/image16.jpg[/img][img]http://www.su…]

As a young adult male, the first thing i noticed is ehr boobs look whacked. Now that we're done with that, it looks good, although i don't think the skin like that great. the closeups of the face are good, but the rest of the body still looks pretty plastic.
On the wolfman, i think it says in one of my books that he renders at about 8 fps or something.
CYer, Blitz

Nah that wolfman demo renders really fast for me, somthing like 40 fps.
God damn, those facial expressions are great. the more I look at her the more real she seems.
And those large pics make great wall papers :) I wish I could see her back, I want to see how those wings connect up.
HMMMM looks like I may have to start saving for one of these cards.

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

http://gamespot.com/gamespot/stories/news/0,10870,2898008,00.html
Heres another small bit of semi-related news involving nvidia geforce FX and unreal engine. Theres only one screenshot though :(

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

quote: i don't think the skin like that great. the closeups of the face are good, but the rest of the body still looks pretty plastic.

The shaders are programmable, so it's not as much of a limitation on the card but more on whoever's programming it I guess.

Since this is a GeforceFX thread... have a look at this website.. http://www.geforcefx.org/ .. cheeky ATI..

Hmmm, according to whois.net geforcefx.org isn't even registered...so perhaps someone is playing funny buggers...or maybe whois.net is slwo updating :P
CYer, Blitz

LOL Are they allowed to do that, damn smartarses :)

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

Ah.. http://www.geforcefx.org/ seems to be pointing to a French 3D magazine site now... earlier today there was an ATI all-in-wonder gfx card page there..

heh.... I wonder when nVidia will notice. Well the new pixel shaders as required for DX9 and OGL2 are meant to be reprogrammable, however nVidia went over the specifications.

I doubt that there will be anything that could use the nv30. So although impressive it would be hard to find anything that will truly use until anotehr year or so. Just like the GeForce 3

I played poker with a Tarot deck the other night. I got a full house and four people died.

--Steven Wright.

I think a lot of the difference in when a card is released and when apps that push it are released has a lot to do with the amount of time it takes to develop the apps. It can be hard to test new code when you don't even have the hardware yet.
CYer, Blitz

Blitz:

The emulator for the opengl extensions for NV30 has been out for a while now. Quite a few people have been playing with it. Obviously nothing like having real hardware to work on, but some people know what's going on, and a lot of people have had the DX9 Beta for quite a while now, so lots of people are already using DX9 HLSL (or Cg), and the new fx files which are really great. Lots of other kewl stuff in there too.

---------------------
Andrew McGregor
Engine programmer
Tycom Studios
andrewm@tycomstudios.com
www.tycomstudios.com
---------------------

Hmm... that's all I'll say.

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

Is it set before the bits of the future you see in the last 2 movies?
Cause that terminator looks poor.

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Reminds me of that robot from the movie "Shortcircuit" from back in the 80's.

http://www.jasondalton.com

Thats not a pic of the actual terminator that gets sent back in time, the new terminator is a female, I think she can take control of other machines

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

quote:Is it set before the bits of the future you see in the last 2 movies?
Cause that terminator looks poor.

I'm guessing it is set at present time when that Terminator 105 (or 1-8 as seen in aome of the pictures) is created. Obviously it looks poor as it's an early model, compared to Arnie's T-800, or Robert Patrick's T-1000..
And now that you mentioned it, it does look similar to Number 5 from Short Circuit [:)]

SIck sick sick ... sick sick....... ..... . sick!!! Mega sick. Whens it coming out????? ... .. .SICK!

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Oh sure, you might say it looks poor, but you wouldn't be complaining if you had one in your bedroom. @;-D

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

I might complain. Still, i've been waiting for this movie for a while. Any leaks on the actors that are going to be in it.!>??

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

quote:Originally posted by Obsolete_386

I might complain. Still, i've been waiting for this movie for a while. Any leaks on the actors that are going to be in it.!>??

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Arnie, of course. Edward Furlong however is not reprising his role of John Connor. At one stage, Vin Diesel was supposed to be in there. Im not sure if that's still the case. Arnie, Vin and the Chick = 3 Terminators = T3.

Vin Diesal isn't in the movie, and Edward Furlong (the young John Connor from Terminator 2) isn't it in either - he's had a bad drug addiction/in rehab at the time, so that role is taken by Nick Stahl (do a google search on that actor).. Claire Danes is in it also, as John Connors girlfriend (you might know her from Romeo + Juliet).. The movie is expected to be released on July 2, 2003..
Edward Furlong seems to be doing much better now though. His name's been linked to "The Crow 4"..

What about sarah?

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Sarah (Linda Hamilton) is in the movie, but only in flashbacks. They haven't filmed new parts for her... just reusing old footage from Terminator 2 or 1 I think..

Terminator 3 trailer is viewable off http://www.apple.com/trailers/wb/t3/

** or you can download it at Ausgamers http://www.ausgamers.com/files/?agn=details&id=4246

If you want to see some screenshot grabs off the trailer, go here..
http://www.talkfilm.co.uk/articles/175/index.html

It looks awesome. [:)]

to get some good news on it, even the basics of the script and some shots from the set that there not ment to have u should check out
www.scifiplanet.net

from what i remember its set before the war, john o conner is a hacker, sarah isn't in it, and the new terminator is a electronic matrix.
The script looked kinda shit.. but james cameron can make anything look good.

Unfortunately James Cameron isn't involved at all with this one. [:)]

nooo we're all dooomed

I certainly hope this movie lives up to the previous two movies. the trailer was impressive in some parts and dirt poor in others.

Hopefully the CG in it will be better in the final movie, still at least 6 months to go so that's very possible. Another thing was Arnie didn't sound like he does in the previous movies, mebbe cuz he's a new model? i dunno. as for the "she'll be back" they coulda thought of something a TAD more original.

what i did like though was Kristinna Loken as T-X, she's got the same look as Robert Patrick in T2. Arnie shows he's still good for action movies by being used as a wrecking ball for half the trailer and the future battle scene looked wicked aswell, hope we get to see quite a bit of post apocayptic earth.

All round the trailer did what it was meant for though, i now wanna see T3!!!

I thought the 'She'll be back' bit was so funny.. and not in a good way [:)] Sounds too corny.. Terminator 2 is well known for some real dodgy one-liners, so I hope T3 doesn't go too overboard with that.. I've visited some sites that captured screen still shots from the trailer, and there are a few elements similar to T2... terminator in a helicopter, getting chased on a motorbike.. I hope the story won't be a carbon copy of T2...

As a first step, i'd suggest getting your hands on a couple of paper&pen RPG books (Dungeons and dragons, shadowrun etc.) and check out their combat systems.
CYer, Blitz

The calculations are a lot more simple then you're conveying them to be. I'm a bit of a DnD fan so here's what i think

All weapons come with a few Specs:
Damage
Class
Accuracy or magic ability
Etc

The damage is done after the player successfully hits the oponent, calculated by:

(Player Skill at using that weapon + Weapon accuracy or magic ability) - (Monster dodge + Monster Armour Class, or AC)
(Don't forget that in DnD there is dice rolling to determine what happens a lot of the time, so don't forget to add a randomness factor)
AC rating is the goodness factor of their armour.

I'll have a bit more of a read of my DnD books tonite and get back to you

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Thanks - seems to be pretty simple so far.. what about lvl building? how much levelling would you gain by beating someone with a similar or greater level etc?.. I guess I'll have to look up some books and examples like Blitz suggested, and hopefully get some decent kind of game play happening. Never played pen and paper DnD in my life, unfortunately.

Level building is generally an exponential function, although I would suggest starting it as a linear function, then at level 10 say (when the player is not a complete newb) make it grow exponentially.

side note, one day i want to implement a robust enough GURPs engine that you can do full magical combat. (to extent of transform earth to air, air to stone etc and deform game map) and nice thing about gurps is that it tries to be ballanced~ but anyway...

if you ever have the inclination, try to find a copy of 'dork tower' comic book, they have some beautlfully balanced small scale games in the back to get some ideas (and they possibly would allow you to do an implementation if you asked)

I wouldn't suggest directly transforming a game system to the computer, since they won't work as intended or will take a lot more work to implement. What I suggest is you use your "Artistic Impression", and modify a few things, make certain things a lot simpler. I dunno maybe in future you can build upon your simple model and add a lot more features to it.

Yep, I'm going after something really simple, like Hack n Slash was. And yeh, something simple and then building upon that is definately the plan. I'm hoping for something like Hack n Slash in playing terms, and pixel art with buildings scenery from a topographic view like in Final Fantasy III on the SNES.. oh, and the battle scenes like that too. Seems very possible to do in Flash..

Sounds pretty good.
For lvl building, make all creatures have a formula for how muck XPerience you get from them. Working out how much you need to go up a level is up to you, but RPG making is a lot of number making. Look at Diablo 2. It would of taken them ages to work out all the numbers for that game.

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Check this out aswell if you have the time
http://quiz.ravenblack.net/blood.pl?biter=Obsolete_386

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Also have a look at this
another similar one with slightly less popups
[url]http://kevan.org/brain.cgi?Meatex[/url]

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Pretty nice
although when i looked at the ut2 trees in the demo they looked pretty simple. Also the trees in that game may just use some clever trick to make them look complex.

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Stalker looks mighty nice, cant wait for it.
Souri definatly write a tut for trees, thats one thing I've never tried my hand at, in-fact I'll take a shot at making a tree tonight. Stalker uses normal maps doesnt it? If anyone has any tuts or info making them, post it here, I know the basic principle, what I dont get is the whole edge loop thingy, I dont know what they are. If somone could explain them in terms a moron can understand that would be great :)

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

I don't think I'll make a tutorial on that now. The games that are coming up now use so much more polygons for trees that it's really up to the modeller has the freedom to come up with many creative ways to get them to look like they do.
I kinda get thefeeling though that we're gonna see a lot more 'forest' levels in games.. I mean, you can do probably 4 types of trees, and 4 types of grass and shrubs - and wala.. instant forest.

Hey there Obselete_386 I'm fine, how are you going?

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

If you want to know what goes on around here, well basically I signed up because its an aussie site, theres news on the local gaming industry and I wanted some webspace to show off shit that I have modelled, If you look at my page theres almost nothing there because I'm busy working on a mod and really have nothing impressive to show. Get a page going and fill-it up. We certainly need more people showing off their stuff around here.
Basically I think this site is a great way to build a localised community, if you want to get into some sort of graphics industry (games or tv and movies)theres probably people around here you can get to know and give you help and theres a good chance they'll live near by. I'm interested in the gaming industry.
So what is your field of interest? Mapping, modelling, 2d all of them?
with me its 3d, soon I'm going to start on a demo reel, I want it to be of top quality(Boy do I kid myself) so you'll have to give me lots of criticism. ERRR I dont think I have really answered your question, really do what ever you like around here :)

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

More info on what Sumea is all about can be read on the about page http://www.sumea.com.au/snews.asp?news=3&related=Sumea ..
If you want to help, feel free to contribute to the site such as submitting interesting news, especially those of revelance to game artists or is related to the Australian industry. I prefer that than constant posts on game updates, patches etc.. I don't want the news section to be a clone of the million other game info sites out there.
Articles are most welcomed too, be they interviews, reviews, or tutorials etc.. as long as it's well written.. Any kind of help in those areas are greatley appreciated.

Thanks guys. This should be pretty sweeet!

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Yeah for something that really can't classify as a typical game its very addictive for a while.
It's the reason i had to change my IT assignment [:0]

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Man, I played waaay too much of that demo last year. @:-D

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

Well if you get the full version then you get plot missions

(Destroy the net or don't)

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Uplink is pretty boring now. Played it out, way to much (Still fun to play when you're bored.)
Got more games on Cube so i'm happy

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

If you could stop these small leaks of developer versions, then you could pretty much stop piracy from taking place. By piracy in this context I mean when you can download a game before its been released, like with what happened with Warcraft3. Usually inside people within the distributer or publisher, or even the security guys in the warehouse could be the leaks.

Personally I think some of these leaks could be intentional, i.e. give the community something to salivate about, before the official demo will be released. Either that or it could have one bad trojan on it?

The leaks usually come from the production/distribution chain. eg. distro warehouses/shops, or the places where they are actually pressing the CD's, or boxing them together. Theres a LOT of people in this chain, and it's quite easy for someone to take a cd out of the production line, write it off as defective, and take it home.
I don't know if this is the case with doom 3 (has it been pressed yet?). Also another great source for early copies of games is game magazines/websites that get a copy of the game early so they can have reviews and previews.
CYer, Blitz

Doom3 hasn't been pressed yet, its actually miles away from completion, basically what was leaked was the demonstration that was put on at E3 earlier this year.

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

Slashdot has just put this up on their site.. http://slashdot.org/articles/02/11/03/1520240.shtml?tid=127
.. It seems like *everyone* is downloading DOOM 3 now.. check out slashdot and you'll find links and newsgroups on where to get it.. id software must be slightly peeved. [}:)] The news was that it was an ATI employee who leaked the game out, based on an irc log with one of the ID employees (Xiam).. however, that was proven to be fake. [:p].. oh well..

where to get it?

Since the leaked beta is pirated software, no-one here will/can help you. Wait for it to be released, and then buy it.

Amazing.. this 7 month old post is still getting views by the truckload. Even though it only had a few replies, it's the highest read thread in the entire forum. 99.9% of all the views of this thread are from people who've arrived here as a result of their "Doom 3 leak download" google search.
Good luck with your 2fps slideshow alpha Doom 3 hunt!

I wonder whether the Quake 3 leak got the same kind of traffic....

Quake 3 was leaked? Damn, twice now with id. Imagine if half-life2 got leaked, The entire internet the world over would be bogged down with everyone trying to get it all at once.

quote:Originally posted by Fluffy CatFood

Quake 3 was leaked? Damn, twice now with id.

Yep, with Q3Tourney5 & Sarge :p + Some other map that we didn't see in the retail, was mainly just for demoing the games features.

Well at least now we know one cheap way of increasing site hits :) Just add the works "Doom 3 leak" somewhere :P

quote:Originally posted by Kris

[quote]Well at least now we know one cheap way of increasing site hits :) Just add the works "Doom 3 leak" somewhere :P

Even better, add the words "Half-Life 2 Demo Leak Alpha Beta" to the site :)

Great, you've done it now Major Clod...

*sigh*

Just hope that google doesn't see that...

Free porn.

Scott.

*rubs eyes*

[url="http://www.webdog.org/cgi-bin/finger.plm?id=6"]Doom 3 gone gold! w00t[/url]!

[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/simagesmisc/nana.gif[/img]

Yes, woooooohhhhhhhhhoooooooooo. August 3rd in the US, so how long will it take before it gets here, not that much longer i presume.

Shouldn't be too long, smart companies these days try to do simulatenous releases...reduces piracy for those people who just can't bear to wait an extra 3 days for the iso+crack :P
CYer, Blitz

As far as I know its being released here on Friday the 13th of August, about a week after the official US release on August 5th.

I can't believe it's almost here! This is the game that caused the huge riff between the top fellows at id software and got Paul Steed booted out of the company! (They should definately update the Masters of Doom book. I'm sure there are tonnes of stories during the production of Doom3).

This is a game that's taken 4 or so years of development from a pretty damn talented team, so it's gonna be a fantastic experience playing those 20 or so hours knowing that thousands and thousands of man hours from guys like Carmack and Kenneth Scott went into it.

I haven't been scared playing a game since Silent Hill 1, and I love all things sci-fi, so I'm looking forward to it [:)]

Whoa! It's fianlly done - Carmack can start on his next (and supposedly final) engine.

Amen Souri

Awesome, well there goes the money I was saving for a new vid card

[url="http://money.cnn.com/2004/07/14/commentary/game_over/column_gaming/inde…"]There's not going to be a dvd version[/url] [:(]

quote:"I know some gamers are hoping to use the DVD players on their machines for something other than watching movies, but there are downsides," he said. "For us the cost of the goods and the cost of the replication and having to make two masters just isn't worth it."

Just make it on DVD only then! [:o)]

Carmack will never die. He likes ferrari's [:D] thats an expensive taste that needs constant feeding. Hopefully he will be writing code until he simply is unable to do so. GO CARMACK

How long has that 'coming soon' box been sitting on the EB shelves now ? 9 months ? [:O]

heh, Carmack will probably spend a while playing with his rocket before he starts his next engine (no double-entendre indended).

quote:it's gonna be a fantastic experience playing those 20 or so hours

I played Doom I/II a lot more than that [;)]. But yes, it'll be awesome.

"DNF will come out before Doom 3." -George Broussard, 2002

[url="http://www.gamedb.com/ssps/0/3/02988"]heh[/url]...

that quote was probably delivered shortly before they restarted work on the game for the nth time.

so does anyone know when quake 4 is coming out :P

I popped into EB this morning and they had no idea it had gone gold, including the manager... mind you i didnt expect them to.

None the less this is great news [:)], only problem is i just bought Command and Conquer Generals ($44.90) and Unreal 2 ($9.75 at EB, the guy screwed up [:P]) so i only have like $80 left but i do have some cash lying around in the bank account...

Good news!

Souri: At least they had the foresight to incorporate the estimated development time of DNF into it's title.

bullet21: You'd have to ask Raven Soft that - they're the ones developing Q4.

You must be at least 18 years old, a US citizen, and willing to relocate to Garland, Texas

doesnt look good

how would someone go about becoming a us citizen

quote:Originally posted by boat


how would someone go about becoming a us citizen

Well i recon they would make you a US citizen if you assassinated Saddam for them [:p]

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Well, If we can get a greencard they should accept us really, that's close to US citizenship.

quote:Originally posted by boat

how would someone go about becoming a us citizen

Becoming a US citizen can be achieved the easiest by:

1. Being born in America
2. Marrying someone who is already a US citizen.

I don't know many other ways, but if you live there for long enough (5 years min or something) you can take a citizenship test or something

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

At our uni we can get development stuff like Visual C++ .Net Professional for about $200 AU. Which is like 10% of the full price of it, which is good. I think they said that they could get 3DS Max for about $700 or so though, so that's not that great a deal, but still.

I think you'll find that most academic institutions offer large discounts to students.

well firstly bazookiegames isn't affiliated with AIE they just give discounts to AIE students cause one of the guys who owns it is a student there.
Also $700 would be a limited license (a full one from discreet is somewhere around 6 G's)

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Yeah well that's what i meant.

whether or not they are part of the AIE or not is irrelevent so...

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

HMMMMMM looks interesting, I hope this isnt the one thats going to be hardware protected. Microsoft are pumping out too many os's when they still havent even perfected the old ones

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

Its interesting to note that it's planning to release it in 2004... partly because MS wants Palladium based hardware available...

Interesting to note that people are touting this as a Security measure for privacy and against Anti-Viral protection?????

I dont know how that one came about, I do know this it is NOT!. It's a Digital Media Control, it does not allow software to run on YOUR MACHINE, unless you have digital certificae X_X...

It's against Piracy and invasaion of privacy on your machine because MS has all the keys to the hardware which you own >.>

Funnilly enough, it only affects Palladium based Software, which means Virus such as the ye ol Stoned will still run, Trojans will still infect and Spyware will keep on running...

So much for that argument >.>

I played poker with a Tarot deck the other night. I got a full house and four people died.

--Steven Wright.

Erm, that's a hoax really...

There are obvious graphical glitches, and someone made it with an image editor program. It fooled me at the start too.

I would not be surprised if they where hoaxed.

However still, it was something worth sharing.

I played poker with a Tarot deck the other night. I got a full house and four people died.

--Steven Wright.

Looks suspiciously like XP with a Photoshop attack to me. Oh well, i don't care how many more OS's they bring out, 98 and 2k is good enought for me [B)]

The universe is big so don't complain

Is that the one with a tonne of small clips from various studios? If so, I've seen it, and I can't wait for it either.. The eye candy is awesome, and I'm looking forward to all the different stories set in the Matrix universe.. it's for the DVD for Matrix 2, right? Another year or so to go! [:)]

i think its 9 short films set in the matrix universe, but i dont think it will be coming out with matrix 2. i think its just its own thing.

where can I get a preview from this shit sounds good

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

You can see the preview here.. http://whatisthematrix.warnerbros.com/rl_cmp/anime_trailer_qt2.html
It really is gonna be excellant.. One of the studios that did a short film was (the now defunct) Square Pictures..

huh ? what happened to square ?

Didn't make as much as expected back on FF the movie, and it wasn't popular enough to warrant another flick, so they had to close up, basically.

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

Brain is referring to Square pictures, btw.. Square pictures was the new arm of Square that concentrated on producing cinematic movies. Final Fantasy - the movie bombed terribly in theatres, and DVD sales still didn't recoup the costs to make and promote the movie, so unfortunately Square decided to close down Square Pictures. The short film was the last thing that the studio did before closing up.
It's a shame though.. the movie blew me away with the 3d work, but the story was pretty dismal. I still bought the DVD though [:)]

oh ok
but there is still a square ?
well thats cool then

Damn that looks good!!

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

Yeah the matrix 2 is going to be good. It would have been good if they had gone with their idea of having 2 movies come out within 2 months of eachother (They were originally making matrix 2 and 3 at the same time). But now they've decided to make it one long film. :P

The universe is big so don't complain

Have you got a link on this? I'm pretty sure they're still sticking with Matrix Reloaded, and Matrix Revolutions as seperate movies.. Comming Attractions (http://corona.bc.ca) had the news a couple of weeks ago that Revolutions is confirmed to appear on November 7, 2003, while Reloaded will be around in May...

No proof that this is true, but i've heard it quite a few times from different people.
Some things get t00 chee-Zy if they true to churn out too many movies.!

The universe is big so don't complain

I'm pretty sure that there will be two seperate movies. They've released the promo posters for Matrix:Reloaded (coming May), and just recently announced Matrix:Revolutions for November 7.. btw, promo posters below.. lookin good. [:)]
[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/simagesmisc/matrix2_teaser1.jpg[/img][img]http:…]
[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/simagesmisc/matrix2_teaser4.jpg[/img][img]http:…]
[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/simagesmisc/poster_monica_full.jpg[/img]

Stupid how most of the heads are cut off, but looks cool.

I wonder if most of it is going to ... oh i can't even think of a good plot for them to do

(T00 M4NY CH33ZY 53QU3L5)

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

I dont have Max 4.2 myself, but I've seen that it has a cartoon renderer, so that could probably be fiddled with to get the cel shaded effect.

One of the forumites here has a tutorial on creating cel-shading (David Coen?) on characters. It's to do with altering the falloff in the material editor or something.

I think older versions of cloth reyes have been relegated to freeware status -- it's a handy wee tool.

Yeh. Cloth reyes plugin has been made free. I think it only applies for the 2.0 or 2.5 plugin only though.

Well i just had a look at cartoon reyes and it is exactly what i am after :)
Also if anyone can tell me any usefull tips on using cloth reyes and getting it too work. (if there are any settings which a very important let me know what they are what they do for example)
I am also confused about how do i model a peice of clothing prior to using CR on it. Like do i model it in its completly crisp form with no folds or anything?
The more info the better
thanks [:)]

#edit
Does anyone know what restrictions the various reyes demos have?
If its just time limit or something i'll get those.
I really hate using older version even if they are free :)

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

think it was clothreyes that i was using earlier this year. could only use it after doing the tutorials (needed to understand sampling as i was using big movements)...

for anime style, why not be creative and do something different, like use usual strong primary colours to deleniate areas of the character, but then have a large realistic cloud refelction map to abstract the surface but with hyper-realistic detail..... or use the 'metal' material setting in max and ramp up the values....

quote:Originally posted by davidcoen
but then have a large realistic cloud refelction map to abstract the surface but with hyper-realistic detail.....

Not really sure exactly what you mean by that (or more importantly what visual effect that would have) but i wouldn't mind doing that kind of thing later on.
I wanted to keep to traditional anime style as i have a pretty short timespan to complete this project (and im a big fan). Also im not that experienced so i think i should try the standard before i go creative [:p]
While i am on the topic of anime anyone here been or going to japanime film festival 02??
Anyway i have 4.5 weeks to finish so im going to get going (im doing plan, timing etc. first)
I'll check back every now and then.
I should have a link for people in about 7 weeks
(im just a poor 56ker [:(])

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

I'm going to a couple of the japanime fest films...can't afford a season pass or anything, but hopefully i'll get to 3 or 5 sessions...
CYer, Blitz

going to see Patlabor3 tomorrow night, wanted to see cowboy bebop but it sold out. nothing else took my fancy (not enough time and a $17 to book tickets...)

'blood' is something i would recomend (on video), a bunch of student under mamoru oishi (ghost in the shell, platlabor2) made a short film with a very definate style, (flat areas of colour and v.dark lighting)

best of luck with your project, was considering animating 4 pages of the ghost in the shell2 manga as a demo reel but wasn't happy with my models for it and not having enough spare time...

DSC

Yeah i wish i had the money to go and see the anime festival when it comes to canberra, but i won't.
Also i have max 4.something, but my celeron 300 (i know it's shite) can't run much

The universe is big so don't complain

When's it coming to Canberra??

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

No idea, but I sure would love to see Patlabor 3. [:)].. how'd that turn out David ?

The anime festival starts here Nov 8th. I can't go cause i don't have enough money[:(]

The universe is big so don't complain

I checked up on more info at the japanime site. Gotta trip into the city at some point and find out the timetable. If there's a chance I could see half of the stuff on show, I'm there. Work can go bugger itself for a coupla days @;-)

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

Platlabor3 rocked. (but then my second favourite anime films is platlabor2, favourite being princess mononoke)

weird seeing elements of platlabor2 in it (mamorou oishi, the director of p2, gts, is quite distinctive) but it was very much a more TV scale movie, art taken down a notch and more domestic charactures (focus is 2 dectectives rather than section2, though I did let out a cheer whenever Goto came on screen)

also very much in the japanese drama tradition of the female ghost seeking revenge. Did like it, but didn't realise that another of the films was by studio ghibli else i would have seen that instead.

DSC

It costs $51 for 6 tickets to see whatever m00/13 you want.

Some c00 ones there, but i have more import things to spend my money on (Like a car)[:D] or a good comp [}:)]

The universe is big so don't complain

Mmmm, true. But, $51 ain't that much really.

Looks like I'll be working the Friday and Saturday nights. Still gotta grab a time listing, see what I could see.

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

$51 is enough for me not to be able to afford it. I got $108.80 for working on Saturday, all of which is going into Car expenses and Y12 Formal (YAY no more schoo0000o00o0oooo0ll in 2 1/2 weeks [Mega Yay])

No money for me for ages n ages n ages

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!![:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]
Thats classic stuff!
CYer, Blitz

It brings a tear to my eye everytime I listen to it. [:D]

*ROFL*

Oh well .... another one bites the dust ^_^

I played poker with a Tarot deck the other night. I got a full house and four people died.

--Steven Wright.

pussy. should have picked a game that you can finish sooner. good training is to rent a game for the weekend and finish it.... (though have only done this twice, working in a games office ment could watch other people play)

then again i have never gone more than 54 hours without sleep...

Think of it as weeding out the human genepool. Okay, not really but if you do anything for 84 hours without sleep you will f*ck yourself up. Unless you count sleeping. Or comas.

On a more serious note, it's a shame and the press will have a field day. Video games get enough crap without this sort of stuff.

Actually, in the articles i've read on this (well, one article really as it all came from the same source), no-one has actually blamed games for anything, they've just stated the facts. So i wouldn't go being to critical of the press (at least in this instance) until they actually go off their rocker :)
CYer, Blitz

Well, the title of the article was "Game blamed for man's death", and I think it's enough to imply that games are harmful.. gotta love the media, hey! Have a look at Ausgamers ( http://www.ausgamers.com ), there's a news item that mentions an NBC report blaming Counterstrike for those Washington sniper murders.. [:P]

In canberra, we often organise big weekend lans to go to. 72hr Lan, i had work on Saturday, i had to sleep at least once and i had dozens of coke cans handy. He must have been on something to last so long

The universe is big so don't complain

Well its no surprise, the mass media has always looked for a scape goat for all of societies ills. You can blame reporters praying on the "masses" with crap like this, it's because the masses demand a scape goat, and at the moment games is it. The Media it self is not concerned about truth and in this day and age, ratings and income are it. Therefore doing this sort of thing is natural survival instinct for them.

Although some people know better, what is there to say. Remember statics show 50% of the populatio is below average ;)

I played poker with a Tarot deck the other night. I got a full house and four people died.

--Steven Wright.

78% of people say that statistics don't prove anything

The universe is big so don't complain

263% of statistics are wrong

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

Statistics consist of

22% Knowledge
52% Assumption
42% Unpredictability
With a error margin of 10-100%

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

The item you requested ( 717785122 ) is invalid or no longer in our database. Please check the number and try again. If this message persists, the item has expired and is no longer available.

ahhhhh they must've removed it. .. anyway, someone had put up Wonderwoman's invisible plane from the movie up for sale. The picture of the plane consisted of nothing but the sky .. it was describe as "will be hard to find once it has been sent".. anyway, it was pretty funny. The bid was up to 16 million dollars, so I guess Ebay found out in no time and took it off..

got stuck in my 'pools of darkness' game (tsr/interplay old rpg) so haven't played anygames for about 2 months. am looking for a copy of 'war inc' however... feel like playing that.

ahhh, win2000, good at keeping me from playing games, now have more bargin bin games that don't work for it that games that do.

Super Mario World (Emulator)

Erm, that's about it, although I play the usual stuff at lan's.

Counter Strike,
Quake3,
Warcraft3,
Soldat,
etc.

Just Finished SOFII, Average at best. Hope to get back into Morrowind as soon as I find the missing cd1 which is required to play it

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

I gotta say, I don't play as much games anymore, apart from the occasional Starcraft and Counterstrike in Internet Cafe's with my friends. Been a bit busy with things.. I'm dying to try out Battlefield 1942 and a tonne of other games though. I'm thinking of hiring some Playstation 2 games over weekends sometime.. I am desperate to play (and finish) Silent Hill 2 before it ages too much. [:)]

Picked up House of the Dead 2 and a lightgun for DC the other day. Sif that ain't mad fun. Also grabbed BleemCast! for Metal Gear Solid, seeing as my PSX's currently dead. Was gonna grab Tony Hawk 2 aswell, but thought rent might be better paid for. @;-)

Still gotta finish War3 too... haven't had an online game for awhile either.

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

PC:
- Unreal Tournamet 2003
cant wait to play with the engine

- Doom 3
I love games that scare the crap outta ya! Resident Evil, Silent Hill etc..

- Eve : Second Genesis
The concept art, design, and the ingame graphics, it just all looks fantastic. I hope they have a single player game in there.

PS2:

- GTA: Vice City
This is gonna be awesome.

- Metal Gear Solid 2 : Substance
Just to see what else they've added.

- Ty, the Tasmanian Tiger
Very curious about this game, and all the Aussie lingo, mate!

XBOX
- Splinter Cell
- Project Ego
- Blinx
- Star wars: KOTOR
- Unreal Championship (if/when xbox live becomes available)
(5 I know! but i won't list any ps2 or ngc :P)

PC
- UT2K3!
- Star wars galaxies
- ummmm....stuff? :P

I thought MGS2: Substance is XBox only?
CYer, Blitz

quote:
I thought MGS2: Substance is XBox only?

No - it's coming to PC's and PS2 as well. The Xbox version will be out first. However, the Xbox version has been canned in Japan -- MGS2 has never been that popular there. It sold about 750,000 all up in Japan. Compare that to 2.1 million pre-orders in the states and a similar number in Europe/PAL territories and you've got a game that will float elsewhere.

Rumour has it that MGS3 is going to be making an appearance soon...

I can't wait for Eve : Second Genesis to come out !! http://www.ve3d.com/Articles.aspx?Mode=Eve http://www.eve-online.com/conceptart/archive/ http://www.eve-online.com/screenshots/21012002/default.asp .. It's a MMORPG set in space.. It reminds me of Elite on the C64, and Frontier on the Amiga - and I've aways wondered when someone was going to push this type of game further, with online capababilities.. And by looking at the concept art and screenshots, I gotta say *wow*.. [:)]
Frontier has to be one of my favourite games ever - it's one of the first games I played where you really felt immersed in a new world, to go where ever you want, do what ever you want, with people going about with their own activities etc.. I'm sure everyone is used that by now, with GTA3 and other titles, but back then, Frontier was it [:)]..
I doubt that I'd ever have the time to play it though. MMORPGs are way too time consuming for folk like me.. hope they do release a demo so we can at least have a glimpse!
Oh, and it looks like Silent Hill 2 will be ported to the PC soon with extra stuff and features.. Nice. [:)]
Oh, oh.. Resident Evil Online.. how cool is that! http://www.gamers.com/game/1254931

doom 3
quake 4

thats all
not much into gaming as i used to be

PC:Unreal2, UT2003, Nolf2, Doom3,Morrowind expansion pack.
GameCube: Eternal Darkness, Metroid, timesplitters2, Medal of honor frontline,Mariosunshine(I know its out but I cant afford it yet)

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

oh yeah resident evil 0 as well

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

only game i'm waiting on is 'war inc', which is already released, but i'm waiting on having some spare time to find it and to play it... (hmmn, seen it on ebay, doh)

hmmn, ok, also waiting on the game im working on to be released (pending artwork and programming to be finished, renderware and karma are interesting though) and in Jonathan's words, i'm "gagging for" it....

DSC

PS2- Timesplitters 2- This game is a dream to play [;)]

PC- Juurassic Park: Operation Genesis- Gonna be an awesome RTS!

Gamecube- Perfect Dark: Zero Hour- This game is gonna rule! Just wish I had a GC[:(]

Coops

HMMMM, I agree, with the whole video games industry being run by idiots quote, I agree games cost too much, in Australia its $100 for console games, $80-$100 for PC games, this is ridiculous. I can understand some games costing that much because of the amount of work put in, but for the average game its a joke. Its not so bad with PCs because the prices drop quickly and there is usually extra content to get off the net, Consoles its bad, I wouldnt pay $90 for tonyhawk or silent scope etc.
This site has an interesting Idea, I'm interested in seeing how it turns out.

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

Did you read the whole site? It's worth it.

The movement actually originated at the Edge Magazine forum and has gained quite a following. Word has it that Edge magazine may do an article on it. I think it's got potential to make people sit up and take notice. A lot of parents dont really realise how much they are paying for the games.

Game development IS expensive work but a lot of the initial cost is money coughed up on behalf of the development studio or with a bit of investment. The actual production of the disks themselves is minimal.

Im not saying it will work, but if it does, it could have some good effects. But one thing we probably all agree on is that games ARE expensive and for those who dont keep up with the reviews and previews (ie mainstream consumers) paying $100+ is a risky proposition. I paid $139-95 for Metal Gear Solid 2 and I pick up most games second hand unless I really, really want it. On Wednesday I picked up THPS3 for $51 NZ ($40 AUD) and if more games were in this price range, they'd see more sales. Just look at what happened when the Xbox price hit $399!

$100 is definately too much to pay for a game, especially those games that have a small replay value. A case in point would be when I hired Metal Gear Solid 2 from the local video store to play on a Playstation 2 for 3 days, which I finished in 2. I would have felt a bit cheated if I had $100 for that (the artwork and everything was top notch, but it wasn't $100+ worth of entertainment).
Game pricing issues have been debated for a long time - people were arguing Commodore 64 games were expensive when they were $30, so it's unlikely things are going to change too soon. The references to the movie and music industry in regards to expensive productions / inexpensive product is a bit unfair though, I think. Games simply don't sell as much units as music CDs or movie tickets. Games are lucky to sell 500,000 copies, whereas CDs and movie tickets usually sell in their millions.. But yeh, I'm sure lower prices would encourage people to buy more games. I sure hope they don't get much higher than $100 any time soon though!

I must say that personally, i very rarely buy games because of the price tag. Over the last 3-4 years, i've bought 2 (full price) xbox games (in the last 9 or so months) and maybe 2-3 (full price) PC games. However, i've also bought about 15+ Cut price/budget PC games. Usually games that are about a year or so old that stores are trying get rid of, i've bought from anywhere between $7 to about $40. And i'll even say, 1 or 2 of those games i've hardly, or haven't played at all, but they looked good at the time, so i bought them. So i do agree that lowering the price of games to around $50 or so would increase impulse buying, and buying in general. If xbox games were $50 i'd probably buy one every couple months, instead of maybe thinking about maybe possibly buying one every 4-5 months.
I think PC prices have a better chance of being able to drop than console prices, because of the large licensing fees that the console makers have to charge to make money. You could still get console prices to drop, but more likely dropping to $60-70 instead of $40-50. I had a friend who was making GBA games...and then stopped after nintendo changed their licensing prices. The publishers gave his team $30,000 front to make the games, but after the licensing changes, his team would have only been making $1 from the sale of every unit, and he would have to pay back the publishers front, so they would have to sell 30,000 units before they saw any money coming in. I don't know what the publishers cut, and what nintendos cuts were exactly, but obviously if prices drop, it has to happen at the publishers end mainly, and for console games also at their end.
Wether it would reduce piracy is interesting. I can only really speak from my personal opinions and actions, but i have very rarely (if at all) downloaded a game *instead* of buying it. I'll download a game, cos it interests me, but if i hadn't been able to download it, i still wouldn't have bought it. I just wouldn't have played it at all. It'd be interesting to see what percentage of people are in my boat, and what percentage are in the "downloaded it instead of buying it" boat. Piracy may be big, but it's possible it's not actually as big a threat to sales as it seems. Of course the larger problem with piracy is not the downloading off the net, but in places where pirated copies are actually sold as legit copies. At that point, people are still forking over money for pirated copies, which, if prices were lowered might be money spent on original copies instead....
Well, i think i should stop typing :P
CYer, Blitz

I too fully agree. The most recent games I've bought have been War3 Collectors Edition (~$150, but being collector's edition you can expect that, I spose), Freedom Force (~$60 on release) and Battlezone 2 (~$30). I've also bought the odd Dreamcast game, because they're now cheap as chips.

I can safely say that the cost of games is preventing me from buying a Gamecube/XBox/PS2, due to the fact that for 2 or 3 games, I could buy another console. This just ain't right to me. So I'd be all for the Fairplay idea.

Seeing everyone's in agreement, what does everyone think about the possibility of this being a well sized boycott in Australia? Imagine if everywhere got in on it. No games sold for a week. Powerful stuff...

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

Just a few crumbs of thought...

I paid $120 for Street Fighter 2 on SNES ten years ago. Heck, I paid $60 for Pole Position on Atari 2600 back when it was released. There are XB/PS2/GC games that cost $120. There are GBA games that cost $60.

I think, especially over the last ten years, games haven't risen in price that much. Having that $100 mental price point that publishers are reticent to go over (much...) helps, too.

I just think it's a part of human nature to say that things are too expensive. I remember people complaining that $30 was too much to pay for Commodore 64 games.

What is clear, to be sure, is that the general public do think that games are too expensive. Actually while I'm on the subject - remember how huge the budget ($5 - $10) games market become on the C64? It singlehandedly put Codemasters on the map and look at them today. Maybe that's needed. I mean, Midas and 3DO are doing 'budget' games and they're doing quite well out of it.

I think the crux of the matter isn't that ALL games are too expensive, but the MEDIOCRE ones are. Why is, say, a AAA title like Super Mario Sunshine the same price as drek like Simpson's Road Rage? If you walk into a car yard, a BMW is more expensive than a Lancer. Prices may not have to be CHEAPER, per se, but they should be RELATIVE.

The final point I wanted to raise is that, especially in the PC market, the first week of sales is critical in the eyes of publishers. I feel bad for the games (and especially its developers, who are typically only one bad selling game away from going under) that are released that week.

Anyway, you can be safely assured that I won't be buying any games that week. Or the week before, or the week after. Who the hell has money to spend on games? :)

But one point to remember is that usually all games cost about the same amount to make and advertise, so there's usually no cost discreptency there like there is between a BMW and a Lancer.

On the other hand I'd expect crappy / mediocre games to go down in price faster than the better games, as they wouldn't be selling as well and the plunge would be faster and more dramatic than the better games.

The one thing that I hate now though is that the expansion packs now a days always contain the original game inside, and cost slightly more than the original. This peeved me off when I first bought MechCommander, because the "Gold" edition came out, but it had the original inside of it and offered a "$19.95 (US) rebate" to the owners of the original. Pretty pathetic IMO, I remember when I got Ghost Bear's Legacy - the expansion pack to MW2, and it cost me $19.99 (US) compared to the original MW2 at $39.95 (US).

Anyways, I generally support their arguments on that site, and if possible I would call all indipendent developers to try and release their own games by themselves, and sell them for a cheaper price, say $20 AU for a game. I'm sure a few thousand people would play for that? And if lots of these indie games sell well for such a small price it may bring it to the attention of the "big boys", and maybe then some change will take place.

That's why hiring rocks

It was really irritating with the N64 when you hired games and they were saved on the cartridge. The chances of you getting the same cartridge back again before someone deletes your game is low.

But now the GameCube (1337o McN337o), all games are saved on your memory card.

Before i buy most games (Except for: Zelda, Starfox Adventure and other games that i'm going to get regardless) I try to hire them first. Then if you like it and you buy it, you don't have to repeat all the work you just did.

The universe is big so don't complain

quote:

But now the GameCube (1337o McN337o)...

What? The?

I believe that was "Leeto McNeeto"

don't ask me where he got that from...

j0o R phf0o13e n00b3|~i|=i<
|-|3 i5 /\u<|-| 1337||35s h4/in9 4n|> i|= j0o <4n'7 r34d i7 7|-|3n jo0 i5 3><7r3/\31y n0o8 h4/!n9
/\|_||-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4[8D][8D][8D][8D]
lol

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

*sigh*

The literacy rate in Australia has just fallen with that last message.

quote:Originally posted by Daemin

*sigh*

The literacy rate in Australia has just fallen with that last message.

I can feel my IQ lowering as I read that message. Just kidding.

"Your stupidity might be your one saving grace."

"EEUGH!?"

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

quote:Originally posted by Meatex_Salami

j0o R phf0o13e n00b3|~i|=i<
|-|3 i5 /\u<|-| 1337||35s h4/in9 4n|> i|= j0o <4n'7 r34d i7 7|-|3n jo0 i5 3><7r3/\31y n0o8 h4/!n9
/\|_||-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4|-|4[8D][8D][8D][8D]
lol

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

It's not that hard to read guys

Just for the n00bs sake, here's the translation (Which i worked out my self):
He is much leetness having and if you cna't read it then you is extremely n00b having
Muhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
(Still not much better in English, readable at best)

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

3@# 7#@7 l@$7 ?0$7 1Z ?|2377? 3@$? 70 |23@|), 1 |)1|)||'7 |23@ll? 7|2? 7#@7 #@|2|). :) |_|7 73#|| @9@1|| 1 |23@ll? 7|2? @7 @ll |||) 1|= _|00 7#0|_|9#7 7#@7 l@$7 ?0$7 |)|20??3|) 73# 1||73l193||(3 l3/3l 0|= @|_|$7|2@l1@... //3ll 70|_|9#. |_|$7|2@l1@||Z /073|) |=0|2 0#|| 0//@|2|) $0 73#? |)3$3|2/3 70 ?3 ?|2@1||//@$#3|) 1||70 @ $7 //#3|23 73#? 7#1|||< 0393 |_|$# 1Z $m@|27

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

That's really good Meatex. Not only did you give a really stupid opinion, but you wrote it in such a way that no one will be able to understand it and reply. f00

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

quote:Originally posted by Obsolete_386

That's really good Meatex. Not only did you give a really stupid opinion, but you wrote it in such a way that no one will be able to understand it and reply. f00

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

How do you know its stupid cause you can't read it [8D]
And all it was anyway was random crap that i thought of so i could confuse and frighten inferior people and... well everyone else [:p]

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

For people who care: There is a site where you can type in ENGLISH, and hit translate, and it 1337amafies it. I can't member the url at mo so i'm soz. Maybe i can beat the information out of meatex at some point

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Back to the actual topic now, Video games need to cost a lot otherwise the 50+ people who made it (Most games anyway) get megXX0r pissed off and don't get shit. They need shit

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

But if you halve the price and sell twice as many copies, the developers will still get the same amount of royalties.
And the costs of producing the hardcopy (box/disc/manual) is minimal...especially with companies starting to put games out in DVD cases now.
CYer, Blitz

quote:Originally posted by Obsolete_386

Back to the actual topic now, Video games need to cost a lot otherwise the 50+ people who made it (Most games anyway) get megXX0r pissed off and don't get shit. They need shit

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

If you read the site, you'd know that most of the development costs are paid up front. Wages, Hardware, Software are all fixed costs - and often taken on by the studios and/or investors. By your rationale, movies on DVD would be the most expensive because of all the people involved in producing a movie (check a blockbuster title for the credits) and I don't know many artists/programmers getting paid like Brad Pitt/Julia Roberts/Harrison Ford etc..

The problem is that the retailler and publishers cuts are too huge. But that in turn is due to royalties paid to Sony/MS/Nintendo. If the way licensing fees were changed, then we could see some effects in pricing.

If games were cheaper, then they'd sell more and the potential user base would expand also. Games are still out of the mass market impulse buy range to be truly massmarket. Case in point: I picked up Tony Hawk Pro Skater 3 for $51 the other day. Would never given it a thought at it's original $129-95 price.

Upfront costs are paid (as well as royalties later, depending on the contract), but publishers/investors are only going to invest a certain amount of money if they expect to get more back. So paying the developers is still an issue because if the returns are less, investors/publishers are going to be willing to put less payment up front, which means developers would have to burden more of the cost themselves, and/or go out of business because they can't afford to run for 18 months on what the publishers are giving them.
So, publishers still need to be assured that they will still be making at least the same amount of money at a cheaper price.
Also, licensing fee's theory works fine for console games, but new release PC games are in the same price range, so wheres the "license fee" going then :)
The lack of a licensing fee does allow for a budget category in PC games, unlike consoles where every game is in the $90-100+ range until it sells a million copies or something. There is a lot of crappy little titles that would be worth $40-50 because they are fun for a short while, or they are fun multiplayer (party games) but are pretty much sucky for single player. But $100 for these titles is ludicrous when there are so many "Better" titles on the shelves.
I think if the console licensers move to a percentage based scheme, or at least created a new budget license (and limited the maximum RRP for instance) it would be highly beneficial.
CYer, Blitz

Just a reminder to everybody, to buy splinter cell on the 29th or 30th of novemeber so you don't have to wait until the 9th of december (if you are gonna do the fair play thing) :)
CYer, Blitz
(If you didn't guess...very excited about splinter cell)

quote:Originally posted by Blitz

Just a reminder to everybody, to buy splinter cell on the 29th or 30th of novemeber so you don't have to wait until the 9th of december (if you are gonna do the fair play thing) :)
CYer, Blitz
(If you didn't guess...very excited about splinter cell)

Me too, the lowest score I've seen is from Gamespot with an 8.6. According to them, it's not a MGS2 beater but it's very very good. I can't help but feel that other sites have gone overboard on their praise and have glossed over what are apparently some of the games faults. Still, opinions and all that.

Well the thing behind reviews and reviewers is to pick the review that you most agree with, share similar tastes to, and then take their reviews with the most weighting. I think I got that from Penny-Arcade.

Uhmm if your curious as to why GBA games cost so much ask Nintendo, last time we checked it costs 40-50 AUS, for each cartridge, for the publisher to push out a fully license game.

Not quite, it costs a publisher 40-50 AUS for each cartridge for the license from nintendo to be used an official licensed GBA game >.>

However it costs a PC game about 2-10 AUS, to get a box out. However the cost of making the game can range upto the $1M+

So it's not just manufactoring costs, but also marketing. After all it has to appeal to an audience. The game could be crap however with the correct marketing teams will become a seller.

I will stop ranting now >.>

I played poker with a Tarot deck the other night. I got a full house and four people died.

--Steven Wright.

quote:Originally posted by JonathanKerr

If you read the site, you'd know that most of the development costs are paid up front. Wages, Hardware, Software are all fixed costs - and often taken on by the studios and/or investors.

There are many games development companies that get paid royalties. This might not be the case on PC as much as on consoles, but you're talking to a console freak
(At one point or another i've owned the following)
Commodore 64
Sega Master System
Sega Mega Drive
Nintendo Entertainment System (NES)
Super Nintendo Entertainment System (SNES)
N64
Gamecube
(Nintendo loyalist now)

100% chance of PAIN, in the GLAVEN

Actually, almost all development companies would be paid in royalties. However, they do also get an upfront payment to spend on developing the game. This upfront cost though is taken out of future royalties. Eg. If a studio gets $50,000 up front, they won't receive any royalties until that $50,000 has been "paid back" to the publisher by royalties off sold software. Of course if the game doesn't sell 25,000 copies or whatever the royalty fee is, the studio keeps the $50,000 and the publisher most likely posts a loss.
If the studio runs over the budget of it's upfront payment then it is screwed if the game bombs.
CYer, Blitz

I've posted it on the main page about the Avault article that explains how game prices got so high.. read it at http://www.avault.com/articles/getarticle.asp?name=stickershock ..

quote:
and what did you think of it ?

After what you said about it being able to run on older comps i started downloading it, i has gots the percentage of 60
Look pretty much the same as the last one
then again looks can be decieving (i know my spelling sucks ay)

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Waiting for a coverdisc. Sick of d/l'ing huge files over this piddly connection. I WANT IT NOW, DAMMIT! @;-)

Chris Bowden
http://brain.gamekey.com/

I got it and I love it! It feels a lot different to the first one(For me anyway) I prefer the way the weapons are now as well. Game runs incredibly well, actually the performance is better than the original.
Bombing run is quite fun, althought I think the level they included for this game type is a bit boring. The two deathmatch levels are well designed and look great, the outdoor one especially.
The animations on the characters blend together incredibly smoothly. The Karma physics make scoring frags even more satisfying, guys bash into walls, get flipped and thrown around etc. I actually spent about half an hour jumping through the lasergrid underneath the goals in the bombing run level just watching my character fall to the bottom bouncing off all of the obstacles.
The new double jump was a great idea, especially when combined with a dodge left/right move, it helps make the game play much more fast paced.

I would recomend downloading it. Its fun although nothing truly innovative about the game play, just a refinement really

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

quote:.I actually spent about half an hour jumping through the lasergrid underneath the goals in the bombing run level just watching my character fall to the bottom bouncing off all of the obstacles.

Hey, I've done that too! I luv it.. I also just have one bot match, and just roam around looking at the levels and details. Design wise, I don't think the look and style is as polished as I had hoped.. The character designs are nice, but they aren't inspiring or incredible.. same with the level designs.. The capture the flag level (the one with thorns everywhere) looked ugly, I thought. They should have worked more on aesthetics, or get some brilliant concept designers.. I've seen some screenshots of other levels where they had lava, skulls, and twisted fleshy things that look straight out of Quake 3.
Anyway, I think the engine has some unbelievable modding potential, and I'm sure people are going to go nuts with it. .. and the physics will have a better use for a racing mod game, I reckon!

from someone working at Epic which I got from Panetcrap, and I think Boat mentioned it a bit earlier in the mod thread..

quote:Will UT2K3 have vehicle and voice support?

Voice, no, not out of the box. We are including a vehicle, but only as an example for mod authors. We're including a vehicle model, a sample map that they can drive it on, etc. It'll be up to them to do something cool with it. The vehicle physics are handled by the karma physics engine.

How cool is that..

Unfortunately the engine is not as good on older machines as souri said :(
Even with everything on lowest possible (including the resolution) it chugs in many areas. Some places are playable but only a few.
My cpu is bottle necking my performance :(
My needs a new cpu, anyone got one to spare :D

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Try playing with only one bot.. or if you have the time, do the benchmark test and show us on here. On mine, with a flythrough, I got an average of 20fps! With bots, something like 6fps .. I get a fairly decent speed with only one bot.

quote:
do the benchmark test and show us on here.

How do i benchmark perform?

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

gawd dang i wanna play it
stupid 56k :(

anyone wanna post me it ?

thats a damn shame you guys cant play it properly, I have it on 1024x768 with 16 bots, it kicks arse!!

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

quote:How do i benchmark perform?

Run the file in UT2003DemoSystem called benchmark.exe ... it'll go through 2 fly bys, and 2 bot matches.. I love the flybys.. I wish I can make them my screensaver.

dm-antalus
5.062404 / 11.374306 / 150.983261 fps
Score = 11.380640

dm-asbestos
7.452466 / 21.931669 / 136.425476 fps
Score = 21.962114

dm-antalus
3.666404 / 5.949231 / 17.776318 fps
Score = 5.953347

dm-asbestos
5.029141 / 10.381495 / 35.174198 fps
Score = 10.389384

Those are my results
hehe don't ask me how i got 150 frames (my resfresh is max out at 60 - yes my monitor also sucks - the moral of this story NEVER buy a compaq computer)
Yeah its definately my cpu bottlenecking the performance as it draws nice effects (like the water etc.) fine with frames around 30ish but it has trouble doing complex geometry i think anyway.

*edit* nah its not the geometry as some complex geometry renders fine it seems to chug when it doing visibility ie. what you can see and what you can't because of geometry

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Edited by - Meatex_Salami on 21/09/2002 16:36:32

Yeah i so want Deus Ex2
in my opinion Deus Ex was the best designed game i have played it was brilliant! I loved it, it was unfortunate it was held back by it's poor engine. God i hate that engine its soooo poor.
Can't say that i'm interested in UT2003 though, mainly cause i doubt i'll be able to run any good :(
I'm also looking foward to the ultimate specail edition of Fellowship Of The Ring that comes out in november.
Also the release of 2 towers is December 18 if i recall correctly.

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

I am hanging out for Doom 3.. yes, it's going to be a while! And I'm holding my hardware upgrade to until it comes out - I have no chance in hell running it on my current system. Mostly looking forward to mucking around with its level editor. I've stopped trying to make levels in Quake 3 ages ago because bsping took too damn long. Can't wait to do some level designs, and add in my own characters..

Movies.. There's Two Towers.. and then there are heaps of good movies coming out next year. Matrix 2, Terminator 3.. and I'm looking forward to "The Fountain", which is going to start filming in Australia in September.. it's a sci-fi with time travel spanning thousands of years.. so yeh, sounds good. I was looking forward to Signs too which I just saw last week.. it was ok.

I actually like Signs
it was nice to see an alien invasion movie that wasn't an action and was done very differently. I disliked the religeous (i didn't spell that right did i?) elements in the movie though.
Doom 3, whens that out?
Not too sure about it though as there isn't all that much information about the game itself out there. Not enough to get me hyped up anyway.
Perhaps the people that hang around at Sumea should look into doing a mod of some sort or perhaps like an animated story. That would be fun.

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Signs wasnt too bad, It had a good feel too it although the aliens looked pissweak to me,
December 18 for the next lord of the rings huh? Awesome!

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

I wasn't hoping it would be another Independance Day, and I appreciate that it's not an alien action movie..(thats why I loved Contact) but I think if you went to see Signs as a movie really about family and relationships, with a bit of science fiction and horror thrown in, then you won't be disappointed.. It's a good movie, but in the same way that Unbreakable was a good movie.. There wasn't much wrong with it, but it just wasn't as good as 6th Sense (which I'm sure everyone will compare M. Shamalayans' movies against).. maybe it didn't have the big ending / twist that I was hoping for.
Doom 3.. I think it'll be out before Quakecon next year, so uh.. under 12 months.. I love horror games (Resident Evil series, Silent Hill), so anything that spooks me out is cool. .. also, the id guys have a very talented art team, so I'm looking forward what they can do with the cool engine.
A mod by the Sumea members? .. well, there's 37 members, so that's quite a big talent pool there.. hehe

...and Lord of the Rings - I can't believe they put that huge spoiler in the trailer!! I reckon they should've left it out. I haven't read the books, so I would've prefered to find out during the movie.. I'm talking about you-know-who in the white robes..

Oh, and Fluffy, happy birthday for tomorrow, mate.

The only stuff i have seen from 2 towers was the stuff on the first DVD
But my mate had already told me about "Mr white robes" :)
Yeah the aliens weren't really that good in the sense that for a horror movie they weren't scary at all
But hey man i still enjoyed it. It seems M. Night is making a name for himself by making intersting and different movies.
I also liked Contact and another good one is Gataca.
I also just got Beutiful Mind on DVD and whatched it with and without director comms (didn't have time to hear Akiva's commentary) and i saw the deleted scenes.
Now there isn't alot of special FX but it is a brilliant movie, Russel deserve the academy award more than Denzel. Alot more, but what can you do. I loved the first shot of him just sitting in the corner. That was really excellent acting. I also liked 2 other scenes but i think i need to stop blabbing on.
We do have a large talent pool indeed, but i have only seen about half of the 37 that visit the forums :(
So what does everyone else think. A MOD or short movie by the sumea guys and girls??
Did anyone else see Band Of Brothers last night. Kind of overhyped i think. But pretty impressive GFX. But i didn't like the overdone handicam shots and was it just me or did it seem to glorify war?

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Souri:"Oh, and Fluffy, happy birthday for tomorrow, mate."

Thanks man, although it will just be another day for me :)

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

If you happen to know of a multiplayer tetris or other puzzle game, co-op fps with bots, decent car racing game etc.. if it would run decent on the machine, lay it on me.

well you may find that half-life would run
I'm not 100% sure though as the engine has been updated a fair bit but give it a try and if it works the majority of HL Mods like DOD and CS will work too.
Also quake 3 should run too if your video card has OpenGL compatability. Its a very well made engine that runs on some very low end systems. You could always try.
Yeah for multi tetris try http://tetrinet.org
Abuse is also pretty fun, it's old and 2d so it's sure to run.
then there is the other quakes and generally all games that use the q2 engine should run on you system, games like sin.
the worms games you could also check out, worm armageddon is great fun and you can play it over network.
there is alot of games out there you just got to find them :P

Bloody hell its a giant harmonica!

Might be tough to find, but Atomic Bomberman was a PC version of the arcade game that was playable over a LAN, and pretty easy on the hardware. Great fun, absolutely insane game.

^ that bomber man would be an awful lots of fun :D

i remember playing 'sega rally championship' on my p75 multiplayer... i dont remember the frame rate being bad, even tho it was 3d. good luck!

Simple Duke3d, shadow warrior or blood

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!

All very excellant suggestions.. thanks

Did you say God ? you gotta check out this site. http://www.arouse.net/jesus/ ..it's hilarious.. they're actual christian book illustrations, but the guy's put some funny captions on them.

oh, and speaking of funny..

LOL pretty funny :) try this site http://www.landoverbaptist.org/
Especially the movie review of scooby doo

Lead paint: delicious but deadly!